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In the fourteenth episode of the third season of the “Saturdays at Seven” conversation series, Todd Ream talks with Laurie M. Joyner, President of St. Norbert College. Joyner opens by exploring the charisms that define the Norbertine religious order and, in turn, St. Norbert College, stressing, in particular, the manner in which communio pervades the campus. As the only Norbertine college in the world, St. Norbert embraces a unique responsibility to the order, the Church, and to the students who make their way to its De Pere, Wisconsin campus for an education. Joyner discusses her own vocational formation as an educator and educational leader, beginning with a calling she received while an undergraduate at Loyola University New Orleans to serve as a sociologist. As a doctoral student at Tulane University, she explored the economic equality which she encountered in New Orleans, returning to Loyola as a faculty member and administrator who continued with that research, seeking ways it informed service to individuals in need in the city. Joyner shares how she came to discern administrative service was part of her calling and the mentors who nurtured that calling through the encouragement and feedback they offered her. Joyner then closes by discussing her appointment as president of St. Norbert, the challenges facing residential liberal arts colleges (even highly regarded ones such as St. Norbert), the hope she sees in the future, and the partnerships and relationships she sought to establish with members of the St. Norbert community, the local community, and the Church.
Todd Ream: Welcome to Saturdays at Seven, Christian Scholar’s Review’s conversation series with thought leaders about the academic vocation and the relationship that vocation shares with the Church. My name is Todd Ream. I have the privilege of serving as the publisher for Christian Scholar’s Review and as the host for Saturdays at Seven. I also have the privilege of serving on the faculty and the administration at Indiana Wesleyan University.
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Our guest is Laurie M. Joyner, President of St. Norbert College. Thank you for joining us.
Laurie Joyner: Oh, thank you for having me.
Todd Ream: St. Norbert College sits on the banks of the Fox River in De Pere, Wisconsin, and founded in 1898, St. Norbert, in addition to its academic reputation, has the distinction of being the only Norbertine college in the world.
Would you please begin by sharing with us who St. Norbert was? What prompted him to establish a religious order and what charisms, particularly communio, came to define that order?
Laurie Joyner: Sure. So St. Norbert was born around 1080 in a small little town near the border of Germany. He was born to a noble family. And being the second son, he was destined for life in the Church, but like a number of saints, he didn’t really fully embrace that calling originally. And let’s just say like to partake in many of the worldly pleasures of the time.
But then as fate would have it, he was on a trip. And as the story goes, lightning struck, scaring his horse and knocked him down. And in that instance, he had a profound conversion and heard something like, “Turn away from evil and pursue good and seek peace in the world.” And so from that moment, it really was quite profound. He became very pious very disciplined.
In fact, in one of the histories of St. Norbert, they talk about his disciplined approach actually killing a couple of his first disciples, right? So he was just very zealous for the Church and in his daily practices.
I would say over time, he became really known as a reformer of the Church as somebody who was known for peace and reconciliation and a strident defender of the Eucharist, right. And so at the request of a Pope, he actually created the Premonstratensians, better known as the Norbertines on Christmas Day in 1120. And from there, the foundations just, you know, spread all over, all over the world.
Todd Ream: Yeah. Wonderful.
Laurie Joyner: Yeah, it’s a great story.
Todd Ream: In what ways do the charisms that inform the pattern of life that members of the order established, what ways do they continue today in terms of the pattern of life lived out with the St. Norbert community?
Laurie Joyner: So we talk about four Norbertine values on, on campus. They are action, contemplation, stability, and of course, communio which you mentioned earlier. And I think you see these values and that charism alive and modeled on campus as well as at the Abbey here in De Pere every single day.
So of course, action is the doing right? Just like Norbert went out and taught and worked on, you know, dealing with some of the toughest conflicts of his time, we do the same thing at the college in our daily activity, but there’s also the expectation that we take time throughout the day to really reflect on why we’re doing what we’re doing. Sometimes we refer to that as being, right. So the action is the doing. The contemplation is the being.
And then the stability piece is unlike the Jesuits say, who talk about having one foot in the air so that they go wherever they’re needed most in the world, it’s quite the opposite with the Norbertines. They are firmly rooted in the community that they’re dedicated to and never leave. So, you know, the Norbertines who are here in De Pere will be here in De Pere for the rest of their life. They’ll be buried here in De Pere. And so the deep sense of linking the college to the community to meet the most pressing needs you feel that, it’s palpable on campus in the way our students engage in applied learning or applied research in the community.
And then communio is really the sense of being of one heart and one mind on, on the way to God. And so the way that gets played out on campus is the expectation in the way we treat each other. I think it’s really felt in the culture here. If you ever have a chance to visit the way I did during my search, you can just feel it. People are kind, respectful, sincere, authentic, trusting, give each other the benefit of the doubt, even when times are tough. And so there’s really a special, healthy culture that’s built up around this notion of communio.
And the way it gets played out on campus is really quite interesting. We’re about ready to start the beginning of the academic year and my favorite, one of my favorite days is the Sunday before classes begin because we kick it off with the Mass of the Holy Spirit. And then we have a big community picnic where the Norbertines, the faculty, the staff and the students are there. And we play games together. We eat together, we have an outdoor concert, and then it culminates with fireworks.
And what I love about that, those hours together, is it really does model the community, the communal life of the Norbertines in the Abbey, which is part of what we’re trying to do here.
Todd Ream: Yeah. Thank you. In addition to the Norbertine tradition, St. Norbert is also animated by the Catholic and liberal arts traditions. Would you offer a description of what is meant by, in particular context there in De Pere by Catholic and then also liberal arts?
Laurie Joyner: Sure. So. You know, I don’t think of them as distinct. I know on our website we list them as though they’re distinct, but to me, the real power of the place is when I think of them as overlapping circles in that area of overlap, is where the magic happens at this place, right?
So if you think about the liberal arts it would be very similar to what you would find at any high quality liberal arts institution. We have a core curriculum where we expect our students to take courses across all the disciplines, you know, the arts, the humanities, the natural sciences, and the social sciences.
We also expect them to be able to apply that. And this is part of the Catholic piece, right? We really do focus on a preferential treatment of the poor. We focus on the importance of finding your calling and contributing to something greater than yourself. And so by engaging those big questions within the four walls of the classroom, but then forcing students to go out into the community and serve others, we think that is where the magic happens.
So I often say experience isn’t the best teacher, but rather the only teacher, right? So I think it’s those, the ethos of the liberal arts within the Catholic context. And then on campus, just the modeling of the communal life of the Norbertines. Those three things together, I think produce the transformation that we see in so many of our graduates. Because through that process, they really figure out who they are, what they value, their place in the world, et cetera.
Todd Ream: Yeah. I want to transition now to asking you about your own formation and how eventually you came to be president of St. Norbert College. You earned a bachelor’s degree in sociology from Loyola University of New Orleans, and then a master’s in a PhD in sociology from Tulane University. At what point did you begin to discern sociology would play a role in terms of how you understood your vocation?
Laurie Joyner: Yeah, so this is, this, I had one of those crystal clear moments. It wasn’t quite like Norbert’s moment of clarity.
Todd Ream: You didn’t get knocked off your horse then at some point.
Laurie Joyner: No, but it was pretty powerful. I was a sophomore at Loyola. And in my mind’s eye, I can literally still see exactly where I was seated in Monroe Hall 157 when I had a moment of clarity. I’ve only had like three of these in my entire life, but I had a moment of clarity that my dream was to go on and get my PhD in sociology and come back to Loyola to become a professor. So my dream was always to be a professor.
And the reason is simple. I was a first generation student who did not come from a family of privilege at all. And my experience at Loyola, that Jesuit Catholic institution was so transformative that I wanted to devote my life to make sure that those types of institutions persisted and thrived for other students behind me. And it was like such a moment of clarity, right, in that classroom.
And then I’m so blessed because my career unfolded exactly the way I experienced that moment of clarity. And I was so fortunate to be able to go back to my alma mater and start out as an adjunct and then become an instructor, and then move on to the tenure track and then become a professor and eventually become an associate dean there.
Todd Ream: Yeah. Thank you.
Did any mentors play a role over the course of that discernment process also, and sort of help draw out the lessons of that experience that you had?
Laurie Joyner: Sure. So definitely at the undergraduate level, one of my sociology professors, Dr. Lydia Voigt for sure. And the Jesuits, quite honestly the group, probably one of the greatest gifts of my life have been the Spiritual Exercises and going through the Spiritual Exercises as a faculty member when I was at Loyola, and just really deepening my understanding of the process of discernment and how to make good decisions that has served me throughout my entire life and it’s still my go-to even today when I have to make big decisions.
And then of course, I, in graduate school Dr. Jim Wright, who was an internationally known poverty and homelessness scholar. I had the good fortune of working with him for five years during my years at Tulane. And that was quite transformative as well.
Todd Ream: In addition to Saint Ignatius of Loyola and his spiritual exercises, are there any other authors to whom you’ve turned that have aided in this discernment process?
Laurie Joyner: Well, one of my favorite books of all time is Heroic Leadership by Chris Lowney, because what I love about that book so much because it’s so tied to our, our faith, right? He talks about leadership not as being something that we do, but really who we are. And, of course, we work on that all throughout our lives. So this notion of really trying to build an integrated life between our profession and our faith has been a consistent theme. And I think that theme came from my time as a faculty member at Loyola.
I’ll never forget, there was a brilliant philosopher at Loyola. His name was Steven Rowntree, were in the bottom floor of Bobet Hall one day, and I was lamenting like, we’re not taking our mission seriously enough, blah, blah, blah. As a junior faculty member, right? And he looked me in the eye and it just, with great generosity, he said, but Laurie, what you don’t realize is that other places don’t even have these conversations.
And then God has a way, He has such a sense of humor because my next stop was at an incredible liberal arts institution that I love, Rollins College, but it was also a secular college. And although I love that college and I love my peers, and I’m still in touch with my team, I knew that would not be a place I could spend my career, because it wouldn’t allow me to sort of link who I was as a person with what I did every day.
So Stephen Rowntree I didn’t know it at the time, I argued with him, but he was right, that these, these faith-based institutions, the key is the conversation never stops about issues of faith and reason.
Todd Ream: Before I ask you about your transition then to administrative work and your service, for example, that began at Rollins, I wanted to ask you in terms of your service as a sociologist, is there a question or a set of questions maybe that get you up in the morning, that capture your attention, that drive you to value contributions that you can make as a person and as a scholar to that discipline?
Laurie Joyner: Sure. So my focus as a sociologist was inequality in all of its forms, most especially poverty and homelessness. So my dissertation for four years, I worked with homeless substance abusers on the streets of New Orleans and in a treatment setting that we built.
And basically it was as an applied sociologist. So I’ve always felt, as I said earlier, like experience isn’t the best teacher, but rather the only teacher. You know, I could read every single book there is about homelessness and poverty, but until you get out there and encounter, you know, what in our society is referred to as the other, you really can’t understand. And so I think recognizing those different ways of knowing is really important.
But it was definitely inequality and my sense that we’re called to recognize like the sacred dignity of every human being. And there’s certain conditions that are just not conducive to human flourishing. I felt like I was called to use my gifts to try to make those situations for individuals better. So I think that’s from a sociological perspective, what really drove me.
Todd Ream: Yeah. Thank you. Thank you very much.
Transitioning now to your service at Rollins, where you served in a variety of senior leadership roles. At what point in time did you discern that your vocation would also find expression as exercised as an administrator?
Laurie Joyner: Yeah, actually it was earlier than that. Literally as soon as I received my letter granting me tenure and promotion, my dean at Loyola called and said, we really need you to serve as an associate dean. And like many administrators, that really was never in my, my plan, right? And so I was reluctant. But then my mentor, Dr. Lydia Voigt and Dean Frank Scully were the two that sort of double teamed me and said, why don’t you just try it? I tried it and I loved it.
So my portfolio at that time, I got to do first-year experience. I was faculty development and I was also, the common curriculum is what it was called at Loyola New Orleans. So my portfolio was really, it was large, it was exciting.
And what I realized is I could impact hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of students in that role. Whereas in my sociology classroom, I was impacting maybe ninety or a hundred a semester. And so I love the idea of being able to have a greater impact. And my dean just really encouraged me. I’ve had wonderful, mostly men, who have just really been incredibly encouraging and saying, you really have a talent for this. You should think about, you know, continuing.
Todd Ream: What did those roles that you served at Rollins then teach you about your distinct voice and calling as an administrator?
Laurie Joyner: Yeah, so again, I had a wonderful president who I think saw something in me that I didn’t see in myself, and so just gave me bigger and bigger pieces of the institution including athletics, which I was very honest with him and said, I have no idea what you’re thinking, but I don’t know anything about athletics.
And I’ll never forget. He said, you’re going to be great. And of course, I think he knew that I would probably eventually become a president. And he said to me after the fact, he didn’t want me to take a presidency and not ever have athletics because athletics gets all kinds of people in trouble. And so I just had wonderfully generous colleagues.
So Penny Parker was the athletic director who just taught me what I needed to know about athletics. Amazing student affairs colleagues who just taught me what I needed to know about student affairs. So before I left Rollins, I actually served as Chief Academic Officer, as well as Chief Student Affairs Officer, and that was just great preparation for the presidency.
Todd Ream: Thank you. Prior to accepting the appointment as president at St. Norbert in 2023, you served as president of Wittenberg University and St. Xavier University. What were the most pronounced lessons you took away from your service at those institutions that then has helped inform how you’ve sought to lead, say, at St. Norbert?
Laurie Joyner: Sure. So I think the overarching lesson comes from it’s a paraphrase quote from a movie that I saw, but I think it captures so well my own leadership, whether it was as a vice president or as a president, and the quote is something like, I’ve never gotten so worried about keeping my job that I forgot to do my job.
And what that says to me is, I think one of the most important things for presidents of faith-based institutions today, it can’t be about you. It has to be about something much greater than any one of us individually. And it calls forth the best way I could put it is moral courage, because there are moments, and I have had a number of these moments throughout my career that are not smooth, where literally everyone is, you know, yelling and screaming and unhappy or whatever.
But as the president, along with the board, you have a duty to do what’s best for your institution, even if that is exceedingly difficult, heart wrenching, painful, et cetera. I guess that’s what I would say. I think you can’t get too attached. And boy, the Spiritual Exercises are great for helping you avoid disordered attachments.
Todd Ream: Thank you.
While the prevailing logic may be that each successive presidency would become more familiar, you have more experience in the role, you’ve done this before, is in fact the third presidency the most familiar, or is there something perhaps to the first time president when everything is new and the role is fresh? What, what would you say, you know, is the logic there and offer in particular for people who might be thinking about making a transition in some capacity?
Laurie Joyner: So, you know what just came into my head when you were asking this question is sort of a phrase we, the Norbertines use “Ever ancient, ever new,” right? Because they’re a 900 plus year-old order, and I would say it’s the same about multiple presidencies. So there are some things that are certainly the same and consistent, but every institution is so rich and unique in its culture, in its traditions, that it really is like ever ancient, ever new in some ways, right. So I think part of, like at St. Norbert, I’m two years in, and I can tell you I feel like I am just scratching the surface.
So just in the last week, I’ve had conversations with students, conversations with the alums from the 1960s and the 1970s. I spent time with a Nobertine going around and blessing our buildings before the beginning of the semester. In every one of those encounters, I have learned new things about the college because we’ll see a new piece of art or we’ll see somebody’s name on a plaque that somebody tells me a story about.
So I think in every new presidency, it takes a while to really understand and appreciate the rich culture and heritage of each place. And I just feel so fortunate and blessed that I’ve learned so much about the Jesuits. I’ve learned so much about the Lutherans. I’ve learned so much about the Mercies, and now I have the opportunity to learn about the Norbertine.
Todd Ream: Yeah. Thank you.
The discernment process then that brought you to St. Norbert. For individuals who are seeking to discern their calling to serve as a president, what advice would you offer them?
Laurie Joyner: I think the most important thing is something I just did with my own PC, president’s cabinet, earlier this week. We had a full day planning session, and where we started was with each person talking a little bit about their why. You know, it was a great TED Talk by Simon Sinek, where he talks about every organization knows what they do. And they also know how they do it, but the really great organizations know why they do what they do. So what we did was we started with our individual why, which I think is really important to get clear on that. I shared mine earlier. I want to make sure that these places thrive so that they can have the transformative impact that they had on my life, right?
So that, that’s your individual why, but then you have to really understand the institutional why, and there has to be tremendous alignment. If there is not tremendous alignment, I would say it’s going to be hard to be successful, it’s going to be hard to be joyful when all of those really hard and difficult times come. But with that alignment, I think you can get through the toughest of times and still have absolute clarity about why you do what you do.
Todd Ream: You mentioned it has been an ongoing process of learning what it is that animates St. Norbert and the culture there. When you first arrived getting up to speed, what did you, what did you do and what did you invest in terms of that process?
Laurie Joyner: Well, even before I arrived, I would say during the search process, I mean, I spent so much time, and I don’t, I didn’t say this earlier, but through the process of discernment for this position, I still had two years left on my contract at St. Xavier, right? So I was not like actively looking. But when I was called about this position, I felt compelled to look because I was in the search, the prior search, in 2016 when I got or accepted the Saint Xavier appointment.
And that just seemed really unusual to me that the same place you would have the opportunity to possibly serve the same place twice. And so I went home and I said to my husband like, I don’t know, I feel like this is like exceedingly unusual and maybe I should take a look. And he said, well, yeah, sure, take a look.
And so I really studied and studied and looked into the tradition, learned as much as I could before I got here. But that’s what led me to that search in the first place. You asked about the process of discernment. It was just, I thought it was so unusual to have the opportunity to be in back-to-back searches.
So and then when I got here, I just spent a lot of time, I spent time with the bishop. I spent time with the Abbott. I spent time with the Norbertines. I spent time on campus just talking to as many people as I could to try to learn as much as I could. And of course, you continue to read and you connect with alumni, you connect with major donors.
And throughout all that process, it’s almost like a puzzle. Like at first, you have these disconnected pieces, but relatively quickly, it starts to create like this beautiful mosaic and sort of, that’s what you continue to build on. And I think that’s what I continue to do today.
Some of the other ways is my husband and I had the opportunity to visit all of the abbeys in Eastern Europe last summer. That was another wonderful way to immerse ourselves and to have, to gain a better appreciation for the worldwide order, and just how big this cause is, right. And the other thing I had learned from that is just how adaptable and resilient the Norbertines are. I mean, obviously you know that from being 900 plus years old, but the way they’ve adapted to meet the needs of the modern world is just amazing.
Todd Ream: Yeah, thank you. According to US News and World Report and their well-known rankings out there, St. Norbert is ranked as one of the top 100 national liberal arts colleges, presently, number 90 to be exact.
Despite that distinction, St. Norbert found itself facing financial challenges in recent years, challenges that many Church-related colleges and universities are also presently facing. As the president, what messages did you find most important to share with St. Norbert’s internal constituents at that time?
Laurie Joyner: Sure. Well first, you know, we need to thank all of those who came before us for that ranking because that is an incredible ranking. And of course, our talented faculty and dedicated staff, that it’s really a reflection of their sense of call, of their work. Norbertines commitment to this institution.
But I think it can be complicated, right? So one of the things about St. Nobert College is, it has an incredibly strong balance sheet, so in many ways we are the envy of lots of other institutions with hundreds of millions of dollars in assets and exceedingly low debt and an enviable endowment, right? So from a balance sheet perspective, just looking in, in fact, if you look at like the Forbes ranking, we’re like right up there, really strong.
The challenge for St. Norbert College came with the annual operating budget because of some of the challenges facing many schools in terms of enrollment with the demographic cliff, the public losing confidence in higher education. More and more students pursuing, you know, other opportunities, two-year schools or trade schools. The fact that you can go straight out of high school and become a welder and make a really nice salary, all of those things are creating headwinds for all of higher education.
So once I figured out the situation, which it didn’t take long, a few weeks, I handled it the way I handle all of these things just with honesty, and radical transparency. I think that’s always the best bet. And just immediately went to the executive committee of the board, went to the full board, went to the faculty and staff leadership, then went to the entire campus and just showed them. And from there rolled our sleeves up and just started doing what needed to be done to make sure that we were living within our means from an annual operating budget perspective.
I don’t want to make this sound, you know, easy. It was heart wrenching and painful and difficult, especially for our community, which I don’t think probably for decades has ever faced anything quite as challenging. But I’m so pleased to say that with the hard work of everyone, we balanced fiscal year ’24. We had positive operating results in fiscal year ’25, which just ended May 31st. And we anticipate balancing fiscal year ’26. So again, we’ve done all the right things to position the college for success, but still, no, there’s lots and lots of headwinds for schools like ours.
Todd Ream: Perhaps these lessons then can be distilled from what you just said, but I do want to ask explicitly, what encouragement would you offer other Church-related college and universities, particularly presidents who were encountering comparable challenges?
Laurie Joyner: So you know, I had the good fortune to be part of a visioning group for Catholic Higher Education through the Association of Catholic Colleges and Universities not too long ago in collaboration with Deloitte in Chicago. And one of the things I said there I’ll repeat here. It’s really important when, especially when a new president comes in, I am a strong believer in 10 years of actual performance data on all key performance metrics, right? There’s no better way to really see the trajectory of your institution than actually seeing all that data.
And so now my board of trustees here at St. Norbert College gets this huge 10-year dashboard, and I think that’s so important because they know if our performance is slipping, basically at the same time, the management team knows our performance is slipping. So that’s the first thing I would say.
The second thing I would say is, you can’t stop there. What we did is a three-year walk forward budget with pressure tested assumptions. You have to make sure that you’re not engaging in magical thinking about, oh, this is an anomaly this year and next year is going to be better, when we know that that is not the trajectory, right?
So what we do here is we simply take the average of our last three years performance on all of those metrics, and that’s what we put as our assumptions that get built into next year’s budget. And as a result of that, there’s no surprise. There hasn’t been any surprises. I mean, it’s not foolproof, you know, we don’t have a crystal ball, but that is a much better and more prudent way of proceeding than being overly optimistic because you don’t want to sort of communicate bad news, right. That just is not working well for places.
Todd Ream: Yep. Thank you. Before we close our conversation, I want to ask you about, go back to asking you about your sense of vocation, in particular as a sociologist and educational leader, how do you define the characteristics or qualities of the academic vocation?
Laurie Joyner: I guess a couple of ways. I’m not exactly sure how to word this, but I think that there’s a generosity of spirit that’s required, right? Like sort of, if you think in the classroom, sort of any of us can go into a classroom and deliver a lecture and leave. But the magic I think that happens at faith-based institutions is we really get to know our students. We get to know their strengths and their weaknesses, their hopes, their aspirations and we try to meet them where they are.
So I think there’s a certain generosity of spirit that has to, I guess, infuse one’s academic vocation to be really effective. So I guess that’s the first one. For the administration, I think is definitely moral courage, what we talked about before and of course, curiosity I think is important.
But not just intellectual curiosity. Recognizing that there’s multiple ways of knowing and trying to be open to that, to those ways, I think, I think those were the most important things to me as I was a faculty member and transitioned to an administrator.
Todd Ream: Yep. Each year, institutions such as St. Norbert welcome new students to the community, but they also welcome a new class of educators. For educators that are new to the community then, and still in the process of discerning their own understanding of the academic vocation, primarily coming out of graduate school or professional school, what unique practices does St. Norbert offer for those faculty members that can help them deepen their sense of vocation and calling, particularly in that place with its unique history?
Laurie Joyner: Sure. So, I’m so proud of this area of this college. So I would say over the last two years, we have really doubled down on this notion of mission integration and I am so fortunate. We have Father Matt Dougherty, who is a Norbertine priest who serves as special advisor to the president for mission integration. And he is just brilliant. He’s actually a biologist but also a theologian, right. And so he’s my go-to person that has just helped me so much.
And he has a partner in that office, Dr. Emily Thelen, who has taught me so much. She’s an expert in the Norbertine order, and so she’s taught me so much about that. So those two together are really working on making sure that mission gets infused in the curriculum, in our co-curricular activities, in the way we use our space in art on campus, in the liturgical life of campus, in all of those different areas.
But to your point, also hiring for mission. So every person that interviews at St. Norbert College goes through a mission interview. And then when they’re hired, we have an onboarding process, and then they engage in a whole series of ongoing formation activities, which it gives me goosebumps because that’s exactly what the Jesuits did when I was just a baby professor and administrator. And it’s just so important to invest in that. And so I just feel like we have such incredible leadership in that office. And so that’s how it happens for us here at St. Norbert College.
Todd Ream: Thank you. For our final set of questions then, I want to ask you, in what ways is the health of the academic vocation, as we’re talking about it, on a Church-related university campus reflective of the health that the relationship that the university shares with the Church?
Laurie Joyner: Yeah, so I often say that St. Norbert College is an educational ministry of the Church. And I have to tell you, I’ve been somewhat surprised when some people look at me strange when I say that, because that seems like such an obvious thing me. But that’s part of the reason I keep saying it because we really are a ministry an educational ministry of the Catholic Church.
So how do we make sure that that flourishes? I think it starts with my relationship with the bishop, like really nurturing and investing in that relationship, and that expands out to the entire diocese of Green Bay. It’s the same thing with the Abbott. Like I intentionally work on nurturing that relationship as well as the relationship with the Nobertines.
I think colleges and universities are so important for the Church in some ways, you know, I, I mean this is common knowledge, like we do some of the thinking for the Church and some of the issues that the Church might not want to really grapple with, it is our purpose to grapple with those things.
And so I think some people get uncomfortable with what might be perceived as a tension between say, academic freedom and, you know, fidelity to Church teaching. That has never really created discomfort for me because we know who we are, right. And we have to have a relentless commitment to pursue truth. And because of who we are as the Catholic Norbertine institution, we know ultimately that’s going to lead us to Truth with a capital T, right? So there’s nothing to be fearful about.
So I always find it interesting the way people get uncomfortable sometimes, like with the notion of certain speakers or whatever, my position is we can’t be fearful of dialogue across differences, even if those differences are, are huge because we’re all striving to, to have a deeper, better, fuller understanding of creation, the Creator, et cetera.
Todd Ream: Thank you. For our final question then today, and you’ve already mentioned one of these ways in terms of the university doing, you know, at least some of the Church’s thinking or being a resource in that regard. In what ways do you think that university can be of greater service to the Church in the years to come, and the Church can also be of greater service to the university?
Laurie Joyner: Well, I think there’s too much of a chasm right now. So this was one thing part of the reason I’ve invested so much time over the prior two years is I don’t know that there was a very strong relationship there, right? So I think by coming together, we’re both sort of pursuing the same goal, right? Evangelization and trying to help people understand that there’s something greater than ourselves.
Now, that doesn’t mean everybody’s going to have the same beliefs. Obviously, we’re fully inclusive, but helping people explore those big questions and helping them come to some resolution for themselves about who they are and what their purpose is, I think that’s one of the things I think St. Norbert College does really well is help students discover their passion and discern their purpose. And I think once you figure that out, that’s actually how we, we live out our calling, our purpose here on earth, right. And become holy hopefully in the process.
Todd Ream: Yeah. Thank you. Thank you very much. Our guest has been Laurie M. Joyner, President of St. Norbert College. Thank you for taking the time to share your insights and wisdom with us.
Laurie Joyner: Oh, thank you very much. It’s been a real pleasure.
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Todd Ream: Thank you for joining us for Saturdays at Seven, Christian Scholars Review’s conversation series with thought leaders about the academic vocation and the relationship that vocation shares with the Church. We invite you to join us again next week for Saturdays at Seven.
